I'm gonna attempt to be Adam Something, don my poundland-bought Wendover Productions logistics hat, and spell out to you like a 5-year old what more than several Jago Hazzard's and Geoff Marshalls could, because I will dive deeper than- [redacted].
I've only started this post as, quite literally, was being called spoilt for choice and made out like I'm the bastion defacto Lord of South London. I wish I was as things would go my way and I would genuinely do for the better for me and the people. However that is not the case and I've decided this post is literally to spite that man, so here's a kind 'f*** no' for that very indigenous male. Even though by the time this post is uploaded, it's been nearly a year since... the things I do to prove a point but be late in delivering from perfectionism and laziness.
As for the enjoyed readers and other people of London and outside London, enjoy the below, as I make use of a rant and turn into constructive words and criticisms and facts to the best of my ability.
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| Tube map without Tube |
Definitely didn't publish this the same day Wendover Productions uploaded a video on Europe's plane-like trains experiment...
Small history lesson, the north side of London was more developed up until the 20th century, but into the 20th century it was discovered much of London's soil was clay especially in the south, thus tunnelling was a difficult endeavour. Furthermore, land acquisition south of the river was easier if need be, allowing for the competition of the historical versions of what we know today as Southwestern Railway, Southern and Southeastern. As well as, competition with trams, which North did have but South had literally everywhere. Unfortunately someone decided electric trams shouldn't exist in the city so you're left with just British Rail. Oh wait, now they have poor performance figures now that they're one big entity. In simpler words, expensive. One beautiful exception was the City and South London railway being Stockwell to discount-Bank which expanded on both ends after an American rail tycoon decreed the absorption of the Charing Cross, Euston & Hampstead Railway to form the current Northern Line, London's first deep level tube.
Of which the people of Sutton vehemently refused a station 'to keep their village feel' thus Morden was the southern terminus, not to original plan. The Northern Heights plan would've been nice having the Mill Hill branch connect with the Edgware branch rather than being awkward shuttles until now but I'm no North Londoner so that's where my fascination for it ends.
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| mikeyashworth Southern Electric - map of the London suburban services - 1931 |
Let's break this down into key problems.
- Areas without stations
Camberwell, Walworth, Upper Norwood, Woodcote, Biggin Hill, Farnborough, Keston.
Then you have stuff like Penge which has two stations; one for Southern/LO and one for Southeastern; yet the entirety of South Norwood only has Norwood Junction. I'll delve into this in the appropriate paragraph regarding Links.
We could probably agree a practically forest place like Keston wouldn't be on the priority list but if some stations in the country average 3 people a day then it's a bad idea not to if you can.
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| Spot the area |
If we turn back time to a century ago, Camberwell did have a station and as did Walworth (Walworth Road Station), though both stations died to passengers due to low usage owing to the successful and cheap trams which would later transform into the current wall of buses on Walworth Road. This was in tandem with World War I which, of course being wartime meant it was closed temporarily, as well as being destroyed infrastructure, thus, the stations closed to passengers and then to goods traffic in 1964.
If we include north of the river, the list of areas would increase of course, to what extent I won't explore as the goal of the post is South London.
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| Patronage of buses + entry/exit of rail slightly unfair due to select stations being in the list |
- Closed stations, fortunate or unfortunate
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| Wikipedia, Ordnance Survey Crystal Palace Parade + rail station |
East Brixton closed and now all of a sudden people want the Overground to serve it.
It's not close enough to be an interchange with Loughborough Junction and also too far from Brixton's town centre, so not a good idea.
Crystal Palace High Level (along with branch stations Upper Sydenham, Lordship Lane, Honor Oak) closed in it's convenient location which is right opposite the Bus Station but that's capitalism doing it's thing, because now 63 (363) runs in it's place.
- Random addendums
When TfL took over the South London line from Southern, as a consequence Battersea Park lost a platform to disuse. That could be used but... then again it's not a TfL station so... At least the Overground runs a service there, albeit parliamentary.
- Links and existing station placements in general
I can get from Streatham to Loughborough Junction, but not from Streatham to Brixton or Streatham to Croydon. Not even Elephant to Croydon without hassle. Hell, even Brixton to Lewisham despite it passing there just like the Overground sinfully does. Yet the tracks on the Thameslink have been diverted via Tulse Hill whenever there are obstructions on the Norwood Junction line, meaning they either run via Streatham or West Norwood & Crystal Palace. Neither can one get from Tulse Hill to Brixton, although by that point jumping on a 415 is quicker. There's tracks that link West Norwood and Streatham. You'd think you could get from Wandsworth to Streatham by some form of public transport, but not even by bus. Which is absurd.
Speaking of Crystal Palace. That's a Southern/LO only station.
Brixton. That's a Southeastern only station.
Penge has both.
See where I'm going with this?
There is the track do a train service that sticks to the A23 corridor north of Croydon and not just into the bloody countryside for the beach goers or Gatwick Airport goers, I do not fault the latter but the spite is with the former though I again do not fault others for wanting an escape from this craphole.
Speaking of Gatwick, it's dedicated express train known even pre-pandemic to be a dubious performer to say the least with the excellence of Thameslink and comparable journey times, in spite of passing along Streatham Common and East Croydon.
The status quo of franchises doesn't make it enticing, or dare I say easily remedied at a moments notice. So the track that can? From Elephant & Castle - Thameslink. Go down through to Streatham as usual. Then don't continue to Mitcham Eastfields/Tooting but go down Streatham Common all the way down to Selhurst. From there to
- West Croydon; leads to Epsom Downs branch or continuing from Epsom southwards. That no follow A23.
- East Croydon; leads to Purley and now it's between two branches terminating in Surrey or following down the vanilla Thameslink again.
Then the roads which are already crowded along the A23 from people deciding to drive since it's not a worthwhile upgrade to rely on the buses, which compounds into a negative feedback loop where the buses themselves get slower. Which is made worse when the route doing the heavy lifting is the 109 and does it mostly alone on the section it's crowded most. The 250 focuses on Green Lane/Parchmore Road which needs both a way to Brixton and Croydon and always has done so under the 159 until the 1980s.
It is odd to think there could've been a branch off the Northern Line at Kennington using the loop to go down the A23, or along Camberwell New Road to Peckham, but now it's found use to Battersea Power Station. The A23 route would've had a new station at Brixton Hill.
Then my next gripe that I've already mentioned and will reiterate but in detail. Brixton.
I understand there's Southeastern tracks that join Thameslink ones but I imagine there still is Thameslink tracks joining to Southeastern ones from the 19th century, though because there wasn't a necessity for Victoria trains in the 20th century given the presence of Southern in, well, the South as well as a bit of complexity I'm trying to slim down. Still, all change costs something but this would be a minimal starting point, even if unfortunately the end goal is only Victoria... of which trains pass through Battersea Park and Wandsworth Road without stopping to the delight of Southeastern passengers but still. Battersea Power Station hail, eh?
I've forgotten that Thameslink tracks leading into Brixton would also benefit me, a Norwood chap as Thameslink goes through Tulse Hill and West Norwood has London Bridge trains anyway.
A madman's thought would be Southern's Beckenham Junction trains ending up serving Bromley South whilst simultaneously serving Brixton all the while going via Crystal Palace, West Norwood, Tulse Hill and Herne Hill. This implies either terminating at Orpington or forking out extra dosh for extra platforms/sidings at Bromley South which personally I wouldn't do for that purpose.
Upon doing research on 353 and it's past and an epiphany that came out of it (an express version of it from Croydon to Orpington), I've accidentally stumbled on something. You can't get from Croydon to Orpington on train without going into Zone 1, and Google isn't a TfL journey planner so it is very reliable.
Then the question is, why?
Oh wait, deregulation franchising privatisation. Funnily enough there was meant to be a 'light rail line' in the early 1900s that made it's way to the 1931 Southern Electric Railways map. The rail spurring from Sanderstead past the areas of Chelsham, Tatsfield, Biggin Hill and Farnborough joining what's now Southeastern territory at Orpington. Whilst the other end has already passed East and South Croydon stations.
If we're talking efficiency of wait time and speed it's probably better to use the tracks via Beckenham Junction but again, I'm not the rail geek here. Though a circular service from a London terminal going via those 'new areas' weighed up against trains from out of London going in an orbital fashion by serving Orpington and Croydon then going back out of London is an interesting thought.
Speaking of borderline London, one fun thing is Tattenham Corner being closer to Epsom Racecourse than Epsom Downs which was made for the horseracing joy, and the tracks when seen from a map seem like they're supposed to have been linked together to form one loop...
I'd want to fault an anomaly like Chislehurst which is closer to Bickley than it is the town of Chislehurst but that's a fault of the people of old, especially since there was another station in the country which escapes my name that has low usage where it's people protested against it's vicinity to the town and thus was a mile off. They were idiots. Perhaps Chislehurst were like that back then.
Catford and Catford Bridge. A genuine spite tale. I enjoyed Jago Hazzard's video on it.
Even though it's East and not South, a point of c2c during engineering works serving Stratford opened up a beneficial non-238 form of transport from Barking but let's gear back to South again.
Wimbledon to Richmond is hilariously cumbersome, the easier route is longer, the quicker way to change at Putney/East Putney from District to SWR requires an out of station interchange.
- The frequency.
The tube, perhaps even Shenfield Metro even if it's now a CrossrailElizabethPurpleTrain Line take for granted the great frequency. Perhaps unless you're the Bakerloo Line but you're a dreg of society. Don't get me wrong Thameslink is also greatly frequent... on it's core section an impressive frequency. Then it splits on both ends, with the Brighton end being the obviously dominant section. The Sutton loop however... I've scratched my head a bit but erm, a service is better than none.
Southern and Southeastern being the worst performing rail operators for a period did not help matters. Only a desperate fool would've succumbed to one blindly. On the plus side Thameslink bounced back from the depths of the pits to an oversubscribed service.
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| Wikipedia Brixton, former East Brixton and Loughborough |
At Brixton you have between the peak 36 train an hour Victoria Line, or the every 15 minute Chatham rail already filled with long distance travellers. No brainer there. That's not to mention the every 7-8 (every 8-9, damn frequency cut) route 2 bus service.
I'm pretty sure the Beckenham Junction via Crystal Palace and West Norwood to Victoria is every 15 cut to every 30 since starting this post, which is half quarter the frequency offered by 227 alone, forget the combination of 249/417. So even if that Southern stretch made it to Bromley, it'd be competing against a quick bus route and two routes whose faster sections should've been combined with a new route, say an X227 but alas this is rail and not buses. Birkbeck being a single track station for the benefit of Tramlink is a bottleneck in and of itself. Something the Netherlands turned into a functioning long platform for both regional trains and trams, an extensive work for Birkbeck but where you want passengers, costs should be secondary if within limits.
A suggestion that interested me was omitting West Dulwich, Sydenham Hill and Kent House on the Swanley branch with an all stations to Sevenoaks via Orpington serving those three stations. With another to divert some of the Southeastern Victoria terminators to Clapham Junction.
Upon feeding that thought, I've realised that, to get from Crystal Palace to Wimbledon, you'd have to go to inbound to Tulse Hill to change for Thameslink to get outbound. Or perhaps change at Clapham Junction for South West Railways. I admit I've been thinking this under the guise of an Overground extension, of which I've fantasized but don't agree with West Croydon branch going down to Sutton, because Sutton rejected the Northern Line and have X26 as their lifeline and ignore Thameslink supposedly.
In reality in the 2000s there was meant to be a Clapham Junction branch for the Southeastern, Victoria-Plumstead trains being diverted to Clapham Junction but in reality they became Cannon Street fodder now. A different plan was for Clapham Junction-Dartford trains via Sidcup.
Going back to Beckenham Junction's Southern line, it's 4 an hour at North Dulwich coming from London Bridge, 2tph to Beckenham and 2tph to Caterham. Where you have 37, 42 and P4 all more frequent than it, whilst 42 is indeed the only one to provide some similarity in areas served, without a doubt slower, but not by a huge margin.
Then there's the case of South West Railways' Epsom trains being hourly when they were much more frequent pre-pandemic and now we're pretty much opened up albeit not obviously to pre-pandemic levels but the train frequency hasn't caught up, and thus people have fled to the car. Avoid crowds if you can 101.
Another problem is that stations close relatively early at night in comparison to relative tube lines. Though as I've written this post and held it like a hostage for months on end, I just want to be done with this and move on. So I won't expand on this point, perhaps I am wrong, perhaps I am not.
So to summarise: Track design, company structure, station locations and lack of stations in areas, and poor frequencies, lack of integration.
Oh well, at least one can get from one station to another mostly without needing to go into centre. Poor North London and GOBLIN. Getting from Milton Keynes Watford Junction on a Southern train albeit hourly is a mood too.
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| Edited fantasy map Whilst I said I'd focus in South, I did address a few things, from others' inspirations. As well as adding history back in the map. |
I've fell in the trap of making longer and longer posts which in turn mean my schedule gets longer and longer, then as I'm a relative perfectionist of my work, it gets even longer. I used to have at least 12 posts in a year, though nowadays it relatively slipped under double digits but oh well. Sometimes I did find myself without creative punch and sometimes I find an idea I avidly want to explore and continue doing so. This one started only from spite, then could've been published by Elizabeth Line opening if I was quick enough but my attention turned to the doom and gloom of the Central London bus review.
Either way, I did rush this post out but I hope you enjoyed the words nonetheless, as much as it it's part-rant as it is valid part-criticism (I hope). Until the next one, not guaranteeing when this time, stay safe!
Sources and articles and yada yada links etecetera woohoo
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